Hi, I’m not very familiar with the distinction, so apologies if I’ve made a mistake. I added osm.org/node/8262966505 based on https://saesdp.sccgov.org/sdpdocs/4215410-SocialDistancingProtocolForm.pdf , which is part of a dataset we were importing at the time. The name is “Milpitas Musallah”, so I was under the impression that place_of_worship=musalla would be appropriate. There are also a few mosques in the area, which the local Islamic communities seem to distinguish from the musallas. I hope this helps!

Fantastic detail here! By the way, I think this is all one building structurally, so it would be more correct to remove the building tag from each of these areas and surround them all with a single building area that connects to all the same nodes along the outer walls. Unfortunately, this will cause the inner walls to go missing from the default Standard layer, but then you can add more details for indoor renderers like indoor= and OpenLevelUp – particularly handy for both Jungle Jim’s locations.

https://community.openstreetmap.org/t/verifying-the-southern-leg-of-the-cincinnati-subway/115820

Changeset 153710886 cleans up one of the bridges a bit more, but it’s quite a tangled mess overall.

No worries, it’s totally understandable. Thanks again for your help in this area!

Hi, thanks for helping to keep this part of the map up to date. Please note that the name=* key (Name field) on a highway=motorway_junction node (Motorway Junction / Exit) is only for when the exit has a special name distinct from the off-ramp’s destinations. This is typical on some toll roads on the East Coast but doesn’t happen at all in California as far as I know. I’ve removed these names in changeset 153269802.

Instead, routers and navigation applications use the destination=* (Destination) and destination:ref=* (Destination Road Numbers) tags on the ramp itself. You’ll notice that these tags don’t appear on the Standard map layer. This is by design, to avoid crowding out other labels and icons. However, other map styles may choose to show them at high zoom levels.

Most of the exit ramps in this area already had destination tags, but some were outdated. I fixed a bunch of exit ramp destinations based on your edits, but there are probably more needing review. Also, most of the entrance ramps are missing destination tags. Adding them would improve turn-by-turn navigation instructions.

Let me know if you have any questions about these tagging conventions.

Hi, the highway=motorway_junction tag is only for the beginning of an exit ramp (off-ramp) or a lane split (fork in the road) on a freeway, not for the end of an entrance ramp (on-ramp). I’ve removed these tags in changeset 153269802.

Would you mind elaborating? Where can we find out more about what was built along this southern part of the proposed route?

Hi, it looks like you may have inadvertently tagged a 770-acre swath as “Bus Parking”. In changeset 151971891, I undid that and tried to identify the school bus depot you were referring to, the one at Vine and Murray. Feel free to make corrections as necessary. Thanks!

Never mind, it looks like someone else tagged the name in changeset 138964948 and you merely converted the area to a multipolygon.

I suggested reverting and trying again, not just returning to the status quo. But if you’d rather finish the job, then you’d upgrade the rest of the tertiary roads to secondary, for consistency with the ones you’ve already upgraded. Unfortunately, you’ll have buried the important crosstown routes among the more local highway feeders, and we’d have fewer tertiary roads left.

Indeed, the level of government doesn’t necessarily guarantee a certain level of importance. But the designated routes are a useful starting point that you seem to be ignoring. Maybe that’s because of the situation in other states that you’re more familiar with? Multiple times you’ve claimed to consider “how roads are used for traveling”. How do you know? Is it possible that you guessed, and that you guessed wrong, as you did in downtown Cincinnati in 2022? [1]

Here are some specific examples of changes I would expect to see. If you disagree, please explain why:

* Lebanon/Columbia should be the same classification as adjoining segments of West Loveland, McKinney, East Kemper, etc. My name is all over this road in Mapillary, but this is a contrived route with plenty of alternatives.

* Camargo and Loveland Madeira south of Remington should be lower than Remington. This is a scenic route, albeit one that sometimes gets overrun by overflow from I-71 and Montgomery.

* Reed Hartman should be higher than most of the other roads we’ve discussed. It’s a traffic reliever for I-71, an almost unique role in the region.

* Snider should be the same as Cox and lower than Tylersville, Mason Montgomery, and Fields Ertel. The traffic counts on these streets aren’t even close.

* Terra Firma Drive should be unclassified. It’s just an access road for a couple of strip malls.

* Bridle Creek/Stillpass should be residential. Not every through street is a collector road. These are unstriped, have kids playing in them [2], and stop for other residential streets.

These changes imply other changes, but we can start here. I can make these changes myself if you prefer, but you know my inclination will be to address these discrepancies by demoting rather than promoting.

[1] https://osmus.slack.com/archives/C7Q912JDT/p1651888896479239
[2] osm.org/node/11938871750

“Which particular roads would you say are overclassified here?”

I am not saying a particular road is overclassified. I’m saying you’re promoting roads haphazardly and inconsistently, resulting in a loss of information. Local consistency is more important than getting a random selection of streets right by a personal impression. I’ll try to give you some context because I hope you’ll at least stick around long enough to finish the job. In fairness, changeset 148744892 turned out better, so I’m struggling to understand what went wrong here.

In Ohio, by design, state-maintained roads numbered under 100 generally run along principal arterial roads, although some segments of these routes have been bypassed. Three-digit state routes are supposed to be less important, but this system has fallen apart in the Cincinnati area because ODOT ran out of two-digit numbers. U.S. 42 and U.S. 22 are obvious primary roads. (They would even be trunk roads, but they’ve been bypassed by the Interstates.)

Butler, central Hamilton, and western Warren counties have laid out a grid of collector streets along section lines. In the remaining areas, the counties have laid out collector streets in more haphazard fashion, often naming each street after its endpoints. These county roads are generally useful for travel across a township, but not across the county.

However, a select few county roads are maintained as crosstown connections, such as Tylersville, Fields Ertel, East Kemper (east of Montgomery), and Glendale Milford (ditto). Similarly, Reed Hartman is a high-capacity traffic reliever for I-71. These arterial roads need to be classified higher than collector streets, but lower than the state-maintained intercity roads.

It makes sense to classify these crosstown roads similarly to the three-digit state routes, which have a similarly sized service area. Note that service area does not always correspond to length. Lebanon/Columbia may appear to form a “crosstown” connection between Loveland and Mason, but that’s a relatively unimportant connection.

I have just described three classification values lower than trunk. You can decide what to call these three values, and then help me update osm.wiki/Ohio/Map_features#Road_classifications

Hi, why did you map a 770-acre “Bus Parking” lot? Did you mean to tag that name on something else?

osm.org/relation/16159204

Some of these changes are reasonable, but I think the majority should be reverted, because the result is incoherent and unrecognizable. It looks good on a map but doesn’t reflect reality very well. Your expectation of secondary roads in this area may be based on traffic or development patterns found elsewhere but not here.

Most of the tertiary roads you reclassified are no more important for access than the other tertiary roads you didn’t reclassify, like East Kemper, Snider, and Pfeiffer. If you reclassify those roads too, there are few if any tertiary roads left. Meanwhile there’s no distinction left between these roads and others like Reed Hartman, Fields Ertel, and Tylersville that are more important for getting across this part of town.

In southwestern Ohio, the level of government that maintains a particular road is a good predictor of the road’s service area and importance to the transportation network. Our starting point has been that state, county, and township/municipal roads should occupy distinct classifications. You can therefore make out some patterns, like the section line roads in Butler County and the destination-named roads in Clermont County.

There are occasional exceptions. For promoting or demoting these individual roads, I suggest consulting an AADT map as a gut check. Otherwise, I think you should adjust your expectations to allow for more variability from metro area to metro area.

Did you use any sources besides Bing aerial imagery (which hasn’t been updated yet)? I’d like to update the lane counts and such, but I haven’t come across recent enough imagery, and ODOT’s SLDs haven’t been updated yet either.

How are you assessing importance?

Also, please consider making your changeset comments more descriptive. You don’t really need to say where you made changes – that’s already obvious from the changeset’s bounding box. Instead, try to say *what* you modified, and why you modified it (if relevant).

Hi, “Donald H. Rolf Circle Freeway” was already tagged as an official_name. It shouldn’t be the primary name because, unlike other monikers like “Cincinnati Bypass”, the official name isn’t signposted anywhere. Similarly, changeset 150817099 should be undone: even though “Staff Sergeant Matt Maupin Veterans Memorial Highway” is posted in one or two places, this is a memorial designation, not intended for wayfinding.

Hi, did you intend to mark NW 31st Ave. as being closed to all traffic between the Chevron and water treatment facility? I’m a bit puzzled as to how StreetComplete’s lane count quest wound up making that change.

This self-storage facility has multiple buildings. You can classify the buildings as being of type “storage”, but only a single feature should be tagged as a Storage Rental facility. Changeset 150814304 draws an area around the site and tags it as Storage Rental.