I’m still having grief with bus routes again. I’m beginning to doubt whether it’s worth doing at all. Where I live, there are several related bus routes with lots of commonality but also lots of exceptions. They run over each other’s partial routes and self-cross all the time.

Doing one such bus route is bad enough, but trying to maintain a load of related ones is a nightmare.

I naively thought that I could take one route, copy/paste it as another relation and just change the different bits. Copy/paste doesn’t work really well in JOSM. I only seem to be able to reliably copy/paste to a “new” relation, which means that the relation-id of a route effectively keeps changing.

I’m now trying to download the XML, make changes manually and re-upload them. However, downloading a relation contains all sorts of other crap, such as “author”,”timestamp”,”revision”, which I can’t sensibly copy into a new relation.

Nobody really supports super-relations, so the only sane way is to keep dependent routes in sync manually. How do other people do this?

Still interested in mapping bus routes as relations. Decided to see if I could tidy up any body else’s.

Oh dear. What’s going on here ? Every bus route relation that I’ve looked at has all the way segments in random orders, even to the extent of mixing the southbound and northbound routes up. Going to spend hours putting them all in the right order.

This got me thinking. Was there ever a time when relations were not ordered ? There seems to be a contingent of people who want to put numbered roles next to bus stops for example. Also, I’ve noticed that OSMRM never seems to show sub-relations in a sensible order, keeping saying “3km to next segment” when the next segment actually adjoins it !

What’s going on here ?

In the area where I’m mapping, I keep coming across ways glued for no apparent reason. I have an intense dislike of gluing, except for when two ways are bound by_definition, such as a County boundary being defined to be coincident with the center line of a river.

Here, I’m trying to add roads to relations, but keep coming up on the situation where the road is glued to two landuses.

Where the two landuses are identical (usually residential), what’s the point of having two polygons butted-up to one another (glued) ? Wouldn’t it be better if these were merged into one landuse ?

I can understand having separate landuse=residential polygons where they are separated from each other by, say, a road. However, where the (line of the) road itself forms the boundary of both landuses, I can’t see the point. Does this hark back to an age when a road was considered to be just a line, of infinite thinness ?

What’s the correct way of handling this.

I’ve been splitting my local bus route up into various segments. The actual route seems to vary almost every trip and the variation is greater within suffix letters than between suffix letters!

The idea is to do it as a super_relation. Not quite sure what this is, or how it works. Information seems to be fragmented. Is route_master an example of a super_relation ?

OSM Relation Manager seems to have been down for ages now.

Would I be right in creating a route_master relation just to assemble various segment options of the bus route into the route variants ? Would any of the main renders recognise it ?

I’ve just noticed, in my bus-routing activities, that someone has apparently created a relation representing the A38. Err, why ? That info can be derived directly from the map and every road segment in this country is supposed to have exactly one road number/letter, isn’t it (with no sharing). Would I be right in deleting this relation ?

Just been trying to put all FMRs route variants on OSM as relations (and then relation/route_master).

Can anyone point me to some relation analyser that actually handles route_master. The two ones that I know about just give “relation empty” or equivalent.

I don’t want any complex analysis; I just want to see the route on a map. This they can do, but not the multiple routes inside a route_master. Why is it so difficult for them to iterate over the contained route relations and render all of them ?