اوپن سٹریٹ میپ
How should we tag LGBTQ venues?
ایہہ 26؍October 2018ء English وچ «amapanda ᚛ᚐᚋᚐᚅᚇᚐ᚜ 🏳️⚧️» لیکھ چھپیا گیا سی۔I’m thinking about how best to tag LGBTQ venues, (e.g. “gay bars”). And I’m not sure how to do it. I’ve started a thread on the tagging@ & diversity-talk@ lists.
Initially I thought lgbtq=yes was a good tag, but now I’m not sure. Does anyone have any advice for a way to tag them in keeping with the OSM tagging conventions?
I’m thnking lgbtq=primary is a good idea. So a LGBTQ bar/”gay bar” would be amenity=bar,lgbtq=primary.
Discussion
ایہہ 26؍October 2018ء 15:49 تے «ChristianSW» ٹپݨی کیتی گئی سی۔
I found this in the wiki:
osm.wiki/Key:gay
As you write, maybe it’s better to use:
lgbtq=yes/only
lgbtq:men=yes/only
ایہہ 26؍October 2018ء 15:55 تے «Alan Trick» ٹپݨی کیتی گئی سی۔
Personally, I think
lgbtq=designatedis the best. Designated (at least in the access tags) doesn’t necessarily mean that it was designated by some official body, just that that is how the space is used in practice by people on the ground.My main concern would be that LGBTQ is too broad of a designation (what if there are gay-specific bars, or trans-specific bar) but I don’t know much about the community to know if that’s realistically an issue.
ایہہ 26؍October 2018ء 16:04 تے «amapanda ᚛ᚐᚋᚐᚅᚇᚐ᚜ 🏳️⚧️» ٹپݨی کیتی گئی سی۔
@ChristianSW I covered problems with the
gay=*tag in my first email, namely the LGBTQ community is larger than just gay (men).@Alan Trick: There are a minority of LGBTQ venues aimed at certain subsets of the LGBTQ community, I think that could be solved with
lgbtq:X=(primary/no/only)" etc. (e.g.lgbtq:lesbian=primary-> mainly a lesbian venue.lgbtq:lesbian=no-> no lesbians allowed.lgbtq:lesbian=onlyonly lesbians (though I'm unsure about 'only')), so further details can be tagged.lgbtq=primary/designed/whatever` can mean “the LGBTQ in general”.I thought about
=designated, and it’s in keeping with OSM conventions. I thought it was only for things officially designed that by an official body. LGBTQ venues aren’t like that. 🤔ایہہ 26؍October 2018ء 16:21 تے «Alan Trick» ٹپݨی کیتی گئی سی۔
I’m mostly familiar with “designated” in the context of bike trails. Often these designations aren’t official because there’s no official body responsible for them. The wiki page does say “typically by a government” but I think this is a case where ground truth is more important.
ایہہ 27؍October 2018ء 19:41 تے «Nelson Minar» ٹپݨی کیتی گئی سی۔
FWIW, right now
gay=*seems most popular, with 686 tags. I agreelgbtqor some variant would be more inclusive, but you might be able to learn something by looking at howgayhas been used so far here: https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/gay#overviewایہہ 30؍October 2018ء 01:44 تے «ftrebien» ٹپݨی کیتی گئی سی۔
In my not-so-extensive experience as a cis gay guy, restrictions and status (friendly vs preferred vs advertised) expected/enforced by services, dance clubs and sex clubs usually apply on:
Reality allows for any combination of these and many more (looking at LGBTTQQIAAP and the Genderbread Person :P), but some are really common and some are very rare. In OSM we usually want both simplicity and expressiveness. I think a scheme inspired by access:conditional could bring interesting possibilities, so I’ll do some research to try to expand on this.
ایہہ 30؍October 2018ء 08:51 تے «amapanda ᚛ᚐᚋᚐᚅᚇᚐ᚜ 🏳️⚧️» ٹپݨی کیتی گئی سی۔
@ftrebrien I’m suggesting
lgbtq:*=*. So one can maplgbtq=primaryfor a simple, general case, and go into more details withlgbtq:lesbian=primary,lgbtq:gay_male=no, etc., etc.ایہہ 11؍November 2018ء 17:00 تے «Carlos_Sánchez» ٹپݨی کیتی گئی سی۔
Why these 5 letters and no others. I prefer a specific word that can unify everyone. Maybe queer or “rainbow”.
ایہہ 12؍November 2018ء 10:58 تے «amapanda ᚛ᚐᚋᚐᚅᚇᚐ᚜ 🏳️⚧️» ٹپݨی کیتی گئی سی۔
@Carlos LGBTQ = lesbian, gay, bi, trans and queer. It’s a common acronym. Not all people identify (or want to identify) as queer, since it has often been used against them.
I’m open to using other acronyms, but I suspect we’ll always come up short. 🙂