OpenStreetMap
I’m thinking about how best to tag LGBTQ venues, (e.g. “gay bars”). And I’m not sure how to do it. I’ve started a thread on the tagging@ & diversity-talk@ lists.
Initially I thought lgbtq=yes was a good tag, but now I’m not sure. Does anyone have any advice for a way to tag them in keeping with the OSM tagging conventions?
I’m thnking lgbtq=primary is a good idea. So a LGBTQ bar/”gay bar” would be amenity=bar,lgbtq=primary.
Discussion
Cummentu di ChristianSW lu 26 October 2018 ê 15:49
I found this in the wiki:
osm.wiki/Key:gay
As you write, maybe it’s better to use:
lgbtq=yes/only
lgbtq:men=yes/only
Cummentu di Alan Trick lu 26 October 2018 ê 15:55
Personally, I think
lgbtq=designatedis the best. Designated (at least in the access tags) doesn’t necessarily mean that it was designated by some official body, just that that is how the space is used in practice by people on the ground.My main concern would be that LGBTQ is too broad of a designation (what if there are gay-specific bars, or trans-specific bar) but I don’t know much about the community to know if that’s realistically an issue.
Cummentu di amapanda ᚛ᚐᚋᚐᚅᚇᚐ᚜ 🏳️⚧️ lu 26 October 2018 ê 16:04
@ChristianSW I covered problems with the
gay=*tag in my first email, namely the LGBTQ community is larger than just gay (men).@Alan Trick: There are a minority of LGBTQ venues aimed at certain subsets of the LGBTQ community, I think that could be solved with
lgbtq:X=(primary/no/only)" etc. (e.g.lgbtq:lesbian=primary-> mainly a lesbian venue.lgbtq:lesbian=no-> no lesbians allowed.lgbtq:lesbian=onlyonly lesbians (though I'm unsure about 'only')), so further details can be tagged.lgbtq=primary/designed/whatever` can mean “the LGBTQ in general”.I thought about
=designated, and it’s in keeping with OSM conventions. I thought it was only for things officially designed that by an official body. LGBTQ venues aren’t like that. 🤔Cummentu di Alan Trick lu 26 October 2018 ê 16:21
I’m mostly familiar with “designated” in the context of bike trails. Often these designations aren’t official because there’s no official body responsible for them. The wiki page does say “typically by a government” but I think this is a case where ground truth is more important.
Cummentu di Nelson Minar lu 27 October 2018 ê 19:41
FWIW, right now
gay=*seems most popular, with 686 tags. I agreelgbtqor some variant would be more inclusive, but you might be able to learn something by looking at howgayhas been used so far here: https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/gay#overviewCummentu di ftrebien lu 30 October 2018 ê 01:44
In my not-so-extensive experience as a cis gay guy, restrictions and status (friendly vs preferred vs advertised) expected/enforced by services, dance clubs and sex clubs usually apply on:
Reality allows for any combination of these and many more (looking at LGBTTQQIAAP and the Genderbread Person :P), but some are really common and some are very rare. In OSM we usually want both simplicity and expressiveness. I think a scheme inspired by access:conditional could bring interesting possibilities, so I’ll do some research to try to expand on this.
Cummentu di amapanda ᚛ᚐᚋᚐᚅᚇᚐ᚜ 🏳️⚧️ lu 30 October 2018 ê 08:51
@ftrebrien I’m suggesting
lgbtq:*=*. So one can maplgbtq=primaryfor a simple, general case, and go into more details withlgbtq:lesbian=primary,lgbtq:gay_male=no, etc., etc.Cummentu di Carlos_Sánchez lu 11 November 2018 ê 17:00
Why these 5 letters and no others. I prefer a specific word that can unify everyone. Maybe queer or “rainbow”.
Cummentu di amapanda ᚛ᚐᚋᚐᚅᚇᚐ᚜ 🏳️⚧️ lu 12 November 2018 ê 10:58
@Carlos LGBTQ = lesbian, gay, bi, trans and queer. It’s a common acronym. Not all people identify (or want to identify) as queer, since it has often been used against them.
I’m open to using other acronyms, but I suspect we’ll always come up short. 🙂